In an interview with FedScoop, Charles Worthington, the VA’s CAIO and CTO, said the agency is engaged in targeted hiring for AI experts while also sustaining its existing modernization efforts. “I wish we could do more,” he said.

While Worthington wrestles with the proposed fiscal year 2025 funding reductions, the VA’s Office of Information and Technology also finds itself in the legislative crosshairs over modernization system upgrades, a supposed lack of AI disclosures and inadequate tech contractor sanctions and ongoing scrutiny over its electronic health record modernization initiative with Oracle Cerner. 

Worthington spoke to FedScoop about the VA’s embrace of AI, the status of its modernization push, how it is handling budget uncertainty and more.

Editor’s note: The transcript has been edited for clarity and length. 

FedScoop: I know that you’ve started your role as the chief AI officer at the Department of Veterans Affairs. And I wanted to circle back on some stuff that we’ve seen the VA engaged with this past year. The Office of Information and Technology has appeared before Congress, where legislators have voiced their concerns for AI disclosures, inadequate contractor sanctions, budgetary pitfalls in the fiscal year 2025 budget for VA OIT and the supply chain system upgrade. What is your response to them?

Charles Worthington: I think AI represents a really big opportunity for the VA and for every agency, because it really changes what our computing systems are going to be capable of. So I think we’re all going to have to work through what that means for our existing systems over the coming years, but I think really there’s hardly any part of VA’s software infrastructure that’s going to be untouched by this change in how computer systems work and what they’re capable of. So I think it’s obviously gonna be a big focus for us and for Congress over the next couple of years. 

FS: I want to take a step back and focus on the foundational infrastructure challenges that the VA has been facing. Do you attribute that to the emerging technologies’ need for more advanced computing power? What does that look like?

CW: I think overall, VA’s technical infrastructure is actually on a pretty good footing. We’ve spent a lot of time in the past 10 years with the migration to the cloud and with really leaning into using a lot of leading commercial products in the software-as-a-service model where that makes sense. So, by and large, I think we’ve done a good job of bringing our systems up to standard. I think it’s always a challenge in the VA and in government to balance the priorities of modernization and taking advantage of new capabilities with the priorities of running everything that you already have.

One of the unique challenges of this moment in time is that almost every aspect of the VA’s operations depends on technology in some way. There’s just a lot of stuff to maintain; I think we have nearly a thousand systems in operations. And then obviously, with something like AI, there’s a lot of new ideas about how we could do even more [to] use technology and even more ways to further our mission. 

FS: In light of these voiced concerns from legislators, as you progress into your role of chief AI officer, how do you anticipate the agency will be able to use emerging technologies like AI to its fullest extent?

CW: I think there’s really two priorities that we have with AI right now. One is, this represents an enormous opportunity to deliver services more effectively and provide great technology services to the VA staff, because these systems are so powerful and can do so many new things. One priority is to take advantage of these technologies, really to make sure that our operations are running as effectively as possible. 

On the other hand, I think this is such a new technology category that a lot of the existing processes we have around technology governance in government don’t apply in exactly the same ways to artificial intelligence. So in a lot of ways, there are novel concerns that AI brings. … With an AI system that is, instead, taking those inputs and then generating a best guess or generating some piece of content, the way that we need to make sure that those systems are working effectively, those are still being developed. At the same time, as we’re trying to take advantage of these new capabilities, we’re also trying to build a framework that will allow us to safely use and deploy these solutions to make sure that we’re upholding the trust that veterans put in us to manage their data securely. 

FS: In what ways is the agency prioritizing AI requirements, especially from the artificial intelligence executive order that we saw last October, and maintaining a competitive edge with the knowledge that the fiscal year 2025 budget has seen a significant clawback of funds?

CW: We are investing a lot in standing up, I would say, the AI operations and governance. We have four main priorities that we’re focused on right now. One is setting up that policy framework and the governance framework for how we’re going to manage these. We have already convened our first AI governance council meeting — we’ve actually had two of them — where we’re starting to discuss how the agency is going to approach managing our inventory of AI use cases and the policies that we’ll use. 

The second priority is really focused on our workforce. We need to make sure that our VA staff have the knowledge and the skills they need to be able to use these solutions effectively and understand what they’re capable of and also their limitations. We need to be able to bring in the right sort of talent to be able to buy and build these sorts of solutions. 

Third, we’re working on our infrastructure [to] make sure that we have the technical infrastructure in place for VA to actually either build or, in some cases, just buy and run AI solutions. 

Then, finally, we have a set of high-priority use cases that we’re really leaning into. This was one of the things that was specifically called out to the VA in the executive order, which was basically to run a couple of pilots — we call them tech sprints — on AI.

FS: I would definitely love to hear some insights from you personally about some challenges you’re anticipating with artificial intelligence, especially as you’ve referenced that the VA has already been using AI.

CW: I think one of the challenges right now is that most of the AI use cases are built in a very separate way from the rest of our computing systems. So if you take a predictive model, it maybe takes a set of inputs and then generates a prediction, which is typically a number. But how do you actually integrate that prediction into a system that somebody’s already using is a challenge that we see, I think, with most of these systems.

In my opinion, integrating AI with more traditional types of software is going to be one of the biggest challenges of the next 10 years. VA has got over a thousand systems and to really leverage these tools effectively, you’d ideally like to see these capabilities integrated tightly with those systems so that it’s all kind of one workflow, and it appears naturally as a way that can assist the person with the task they’re trying to achieve, as opposed to something that’s in a different window that they’ve got to flip back and forth between. 

I feel like right now, we’re in that awkward stage where most of these tools are a different window … where there’s a lot of flipping back and forth between tools and figuring out how best to integrate those AI tools with the more traditional systems. I think that’s just kind of a relatively unfigured-out problem. Especially, if you think of a place like VA, where we have a lot of legacy systems, things that have been built over the past number of decades, oftentimes updating those is not the easiest thing. So I think it really speaks to the importance of modernizing our software systems to make them easier to change, more flexible, so that we can add things like AI or just other enhancements.

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As Congress on Wednesday got close to suspending the United States’ debt ceiling and limit spending, including rescinding some funds appropriated for federal government IT spending, the Government Accountability Office (GAO) says more money will likely be needed for the IT modernization in the near future despite the ongoing battles to restrict spending.

“This probably is not what you want to hear given the current fiscal environment, however, [IT] modernization may not be a cost saving endeavor. What we do get are newer systems that are more efficient, better functionality and stronger security,” said Kevin Walsh, Director of Information Technology and Cybersecurity at the GAO during a Senate Homeland Security Committee hearing on ‘Modernizing DHS’s Mission-Critical Legacy IT Systems.’

Some prominent Democrats in Congress and Biden administration cabinet secretaries have voiced serious concerns about threats to IT modernization within the federal government due to restrictions or caps in federal agency budgets that Republicans in Congress have pushed for.

DHS was criticized during the hearing by Senator Maggie Hasan, D-N.H., for not providing Congress an agency- wide IT modernization plan despite Hasan asking for one in 2020 and 2022, which DHS chief information officer Eric Hysen said was not needed because the DHS IT budget provides the plan and priorities of the agency. 

Furthermore, Hysen said that DHS will update its IT strategic plan and submit that to Congress before the end of the fiscal year in order to provide further clarity on its IT modernizations plans and justifications for its budget. 

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If House Republicans’ goals to balance the federal budget through proposals to cap the budget succeed while they are in the majority, Kilmer said it could severely handicap federal IT advancement efforts. 

“I think the biggest thing that might disrupt federal IT improvement is if the Republican plan as announced to markup appropriations bills to fiscal year 2022 levels, then a lot of efforts at modernization won’t be funded,” said Kilmer during a wide-ranging interview with FedScoop.

“I think there’s a lot of priorities that won’t get funded, and any sort of IT modernization are included among the things that would be in jeopardy,” he added. 

Kilmer, who is the ranking member of the new House Administration Subcommittee on Modernization and the former chair of the House Select Committee on the Modernization of Congress for the past four years, is focused on how to bring congressional technology into the 21st century and facilitate more bipartisan collaboration.

The Select Committee to Modernize Congress was initially approved in 2019 and unlike many other reform efforts, the committee both made recommendations and assisted with policy implementation efforts.

The committee has made progress on 132 of the 202 recommendations it passed in the 116th and 117th Congress, including 45 which have been fully implemented and 87 that have been partially implemented.

One of the more urgent IT -related modernization recommendations made by the committee is the implementation of technology tools allowing complaints submitted by constituents to all Congressional offices to be aggregated in an anonymized way. According to the committee, this would allow systemic issues to be identified more quickly.

“You should be able to plug into the system and say, hey, it’s not just our office that’s realizing there’s this wait time problems at the VA. It’s a bunch of offices that are saying that, hey, it sounds like we have a wait time problem with the VA. Let’s fix that,” Kilmer said.

“This would in essence be a customer relationship management software, solutions that you’re just aggregating the data on a bunch of different customers,” he added.

Improving the rapport between representatives and their constituents is a key driver of Kilmer’s interest in modernizing Congress. When asked why he was drawn to leading these efforts, the lawmaker said: “I’m conscious of the fact that I’m a member of an institution that according to recent polling is less popular than head lice, colonoscopies, and the rock band Nickelback.”

“I’m also conscious of the fact that the institution frequently punches below its weight. And so my options were hindering it, being frustrated or doing something about it. And so I wanted to be involved with this modernization committee,” he added.

Kilmer noted also that there are significant areas of technology policy where Republicans and Democrats largely agree but that getting legislation over the line still remains a challenge.

“There’s generally been agreement for example that we should do something related to privacy policy, and yet haven’t been able to get across the finish line,” Kilmer said. “In my view, the more concerning part than the fact that there are some issues that are partisan is the fact that Congress has not been able to move forward some things that are bipartisan.”

“We’ll see what happens on these issues in terms of consumer protection, and particularly protection of kids with regard to social media. Something could happen there,” said Kilmer.

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In its budget request, the White House appears to be focused on supporting federal agencies with pressing IT modernization needs and those that provide critical federal services in need of improved customer experience, according to budget documents released by the Office of Management and Budget (OMB). 

“The Administration is focused on understanding where agencies are on their IT modernization journeys and making intentional investments at the right time to enable secure technology and innovation to advance from year to year,” the budget request explains.

Here are some of the highlights of major federal IT spending requested in Biden’s budget for 2024:

• $6.4 billion — $619 million above the 2023 enacted level — for the VA’s Office of Information Technology (IT) to continue upgrades to VA IT systems;
• $1.9 billion to continue modernizing the VA’s problem-ridden electronic health record (EHR) system to ensure veterans “receive world-class healthcare well into the future;”

• $3.1 billion for the Cybersecurity and Infrastructure Security Agency (CISA), an increase of $145 million compared to last year. That includes $98 million to implement the Cyber Incident Reporting for Critical Infrastructure Act and $425 million to improve internal cybersecurity and analytical capabilities;
• $1.4 billion — a 10% increase from the 2023 enacted level — for Social Security Administration (SSA) IT system modernization and to invest in staff and other improvements at the SSA;

• $119 million to support GSA in continuing its work implementing priority digital programs such as the US Web Design System, Digital Analytics Program, Digital.gov, and Search.gov;

• $6.6 million for the Office of Personnel Management (OPM) to modernize federal retirement services including expanding a pilot for online retirement applications and beginning to fund additional IT modernization initiatives akin to a case management system;

• $11 million for the Department of Health and Human Services to test ways to improve access to benefits for people facing financial shock by improving underlying eligibility data services and systems. It also requests $9 million for HHS and SSA to jointly pilot efforts to improve the Medicare enrollment experience; and

• $1 million for the United States Forest Service to pilot increased access to digital maps of Federal lands on Recreation.gov.

The White House said that the 2024 budget request also aims to tap into the strengths of cutting-edge technologies like digital identity and artificial intelligence (AI) while restructuring the security capabilities of software and cloud services used by the federal government. 

“The Administration is leading on the technology issues of the day, taking concrete steps to protect the Nation’s Federal systems from compromises, leveraging the benefits of digital identity and artificial intelligence while balancing risk, redefining security expectations for software and the cloud, and maximizing the impact of taxpayer dollars to deliver a better customer experience for the American people,” the budget request explained.  

Notably, Biden’s budget also proposes boosting cybersecurity-focused programs across a range of other federal agencies as well.

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